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| From | Message | Posted by cjjpeterson www6conf.org
1/24/2007 21:42:33 Play online chess | Subject: K-B-N checkmate
Message: My friend cj_leonine and I were playing a little otb today and came across this situation. We spent roughly 2 hours trying to find a strategy for a K-B-N checkmate. Is there a basic strategy to follow? Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
cjjpeterson
| Posted by ganstaman www6conf.org
1/24/2007 22:02:29 Play online chess |
Message: There are many resources out there, and I'm sure others will post some of them. Personally, I love wikipedia for everything and the Xs in the diagrams are nice.
-> en.wikipedia.org
Enjoy. By the way, I've read all this before, but I can't do it (I don't think). One of those things that you learn really well, never use, and then completely forget. But have fun if you want.
| Posted by far1ey www6conf.org
1/24/2007 22:10:48 Play online chess |
Message: This has never happened to me although I have spent a few hours by myself just toying with the situation. From this I gathered that you need the knight to cover the opposite coloured squares which the bishop covers. ie if you have a white squared bishop the knight should try cover the black squares. From there you make little "barriers" as shown in the wikipedia article given by ganstaman. During a game I would suggest that instead of trying to force the king into the corner/checkmate just work on getting a barrier up towards the corner which you will mate in. Then just walk the king over and mate. ——— Magnus Carlsen stands out from Corus — Magnus Carlsen, the 19-year-old chess grandmaster from Norway, won the Corus tournament in Wijk aan Zee, Netherlands. Since October, Carlsen has won three elite chess events plus the World Blitz Chess Championship. His latest success will boost his 2810 rating to an estimated 2814, the second highest in history. This triumph was more difficult, as first Alexey Shirov of Spain and then Vladimir Kramnik of Russia held the lead. Kramnik defeated Carlsen in the ninth round but finished weakly with three draws and a loss to world chess champion Viswanathan Anand of India. However, Carlsen rebounded with two more wins for a score of ...
Posted by ionadowman www6conf.org
1/25/2007 01:59:40 Play online chess | I've had this configuration...
Message: ... 3 times in offhand games, and won them all. But don't ask me the correct strategy. I was lucky in all 3 games that the enemy king was already confined to a fairly small sector of the board and couldn't get away.
First of all there are just 2 squares that checkmate can be forced on: the two corner squares that the bishop can reach (i.e. a1 and h8 for the dark=squared bishop, and h1 or a8 for the light-squared bishop). So the trick is to herd the king to one of those corners.
Bear in mind checkmate can be delivered on any edge square. This possibility helps drive the enemy K.For instance:
w
White plays 1.Be7+ Kg7 Black can not play 1...Ke8? on account of 2.Nd6# or 2.Nf6#
Now the BK is very close to the corner we want him at. But we can't let him escape via g6, h5 etc. So:
2.Ng3 ... the N and B have created a barrier along the 5th rank, whilst K and B guard the f-file.
2...Kg6
3.Bh4 Partly a waiting move, but also to vacate e7 for the WK
3...Kg7
4.Ke7 Kg6 A bid for freedom!
5.Kf8 Kh7 ...gains a tempo over Kh6, but that's all.
6.Kf7 Kh6
7.Bf6 Kh7
8.Bg5 Kh8 Now White manoeuvres his knight so that it reaches f8 with check
There are any number of routes you can take. The journey will take 4 moves:
9.Ne2 Kh7
10.Nd4 Kh8
11.Ne6 Kh7
12.Nf8+ Kh8
13.Bf6#
Suppose Black tried the tricky 4...Kg8!? White could play 5.Kf6, but he's really just marking time so doing. Preferable is
4...Kg8
5.Bf6 Kh7
6.Kf7 Kh6
7.Bh4 Kh7
8.Bg5 Kh8 arriving at the same position at move 8 in the other line.
It is possible that wikipedia will give a quicker mate from the diagram than I've shown here, I haven't checked. But, highly favourable though this position is for White, it does show the use of a mate threat to drive the enemy king, and how K, N and B create barriers driving the King into a corner.
Note that the checkmate by the bishop along the diagonal is the only one that can be forced.
Cheers,
Ion
——— The Scotch Opening, part 5: a dynamic endgame opportunity — How does White do something with this passive position? Howell-Werle, London 2009. White to play. Concluding our brief survey of the Scotch (1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 d4 exd4 4 Nxd4), we look at the kind of dynamic endgame struggle that can arise from this old but still important chess opening. RB White's position after 1 exf5 Nxf5 2 Re1 (or 2 e4, or 2 Kd2) is so passive – and the e-pawn likely to be a long-term weakness – that White's best chance is to push with 1 e5. Assuming Black takes (1...d5 2 Na4 followed by Nc5 would give the white knight a great post ) with 1...dxe5, White has 2 Bc4, developing his bishop ...
Posted by spijker www6conf.org
1/25/2007 07:07:11 Play online chess |
Message: It seems correct what ionadowman writes, but it is possible to mate the king on a field that is not in a corner. It's is a fact that that kind of positions can not be forced.
See white: Kg3,Nf3 and Bd3. Black Kf1.
It is also possible to mate in a corner that is not of the color from the bishop.
White: Kc1,Bb1 en Nb3 Black Ka1. So you must always play carefull if you don't want to be mated! ——— Chess notes — All eyes this week were on the Corus chess tournament at Wijk aan Zee, the Netherlands, which had about everything one could hope for: drama, contention, star players, and great chess. The event’s sponsor, Corus, is a steel manufacturing and construction company, which was recently acquired by Tate Steel, India’s second largest privately held company. This corporation is a sponsor of many athletic and cultural events throughout Europe and hopefully will continue this great chess event in future years. The “Corus Line’’ in this tourney included, among its 14 contestants, nearly all of the world’s leading Grandmasters, except for Veselin Topalov of Bulgaria and Levon Aronian of ...
Posted by ionadowman www6conf.org
1/26/2007 11:53:00 Play online chess | Those unforced mates...
Message: ... mentioned by spijker are worth knowing. They can be used, as the one illustrated in the 13-move mate above, as threats to further your cause. Here they are pictured:
b
or
b
Cheers - ——— World's No. 1 Chess Player Widens Lead Over His Biggest Rivals — History will record 1990 as a great year for chess players: it was when three of the current top 25 players in the world were born. The youngest of the three is Magnus Carlsen of Norway, who is No. 1 in the world. Of the other two, Maxime Vachier-Lagrave of France is No. 18, and Sergey Karjakin, who was born in Ukraine but now plays for Russia, is No. 21. Under different circumstances, Karjakin and Vachier-Lagrave would be considered potential world chess champions. But just as the talented players in the 2003 N.B.A. draft have labored in LeBron James’s shadow, Karjakin and Vachier-Lagrave have been eclipsed by Carlsen. In Karjakin’s case, it is puzzling. He was the youngest ...
Posted by wschmidt www6conf.org
1/26/2007 12:46:47 Play online chess | And, to pick up on a sensitive subject
Message: in another thread, you could spend some time using an online endgame tablebase to see how it's done! ——— Vishy Anand helps Magnus Carlsen to claim Corus crown — When Vishy Anand drew his first nine games at Corus Wijk aan Zee last week, opinions were divided on whether the world chess champion had lost his edge or was simply taking a well-paid rest before his April title defence in Sofia against Veselin Topalov. Then Anand acted as Corus king-maker, beating Alexei Shirov and Vlad Kramnik, so that the pair finished half a point behind Magnus Carlsen. Norway's world No1 had previously won at Pearl Spring in China and the London Classic and finished second at the Tal Memorial, His fine run continued at Wijk, and the live ratings now make him the all-time No2 to Garry Kasparov. Carlsen had final-round luck in Holland, and the impression is that ...
Posted by ionadowman www6conf.org
1/27/2007 01:44:16 Play online chess | Indeed you could...
Message: ...as indeed I could have done with the position I posted on Jan 25th. But I didn't, nor did I consult wikipedia, though I had seen its article several months, maybe a year, ago.
I originally just wanted to set up the "unforced checkmate as threat" position, but then thought I'd just play it out. It turned out to be not hard, took maybe 5 minutes, yet had some nice, instructive, features in the 13 move sequence.
On the subject of this particular ending, wikipedia gives you a general strategy that helps you to set up blocks to the enemy king's escape. A TableBase like the Nalimov gives you particular moves.
Now it has been established that use of the latter is held to be the equivalent to using an engine if you are using it to determine moves in an ongoing game. But what about the wikipedia article? It does give a sample line (I'm going by memory here), but only as an illustration of the strategy you ought to follow. Is it OK to use that?
I think I'll repeat this question in the other thread...
| Posted by kewms www6conf.org
1/27/2007 06:22:40 Play online chess |
Message: If the Wikipedia article is forbidden, so is every endgame book ever written. They all demonstrate the procedures for basic checkmates. It seems pretty clear from the Official Response in the other thread that banning endgame books was not the intent of the rule.
| Posted by buddie www6conf.org
2/02/2007 15:29:59 Play online chess |
Message: Here's an example of the K+N+B v K ending in action.
board #3582174
The pure ending starts at move 102(!) if you don't want to replay the whole game.
By the way, anybody had a Gameknot game longer than 130 moves?
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